Orlando - Discussions on Chapters 3 & 4

Orlando by Virginia Woolf - Chapters three & four

Loving it, the philosophy, the fun, the reflections upon time, gender and societal expectation of gender.

Me too! Love her thoughts on how people conform (or don't) to society's ideas of gender roles, and how important clothing is, freeing the male and restricting the female. Wonderful stuff!

I just love the humor! I'm a huge Georgette Heyer fan and the descriptions of the society functions had me practically rolling on the floor--the "assemblies," the "tea parties," and the "witty, intellectual gatherings" were a hoot. So far this book seems to be a great "send up" of so many British customs and mores--her acerbic wit is delightful.

I love Woolf''s humour and her descriptions of gender and coventions.

Some quotes I really love:

"And she fell to thinking what an odd pass we have come to when all a woman's beauty has to be kept covered lest a sailor may fall from a mast-head."

"The comforts of ignorance seemed utterly denied her".

"A silly song of Shakespeare's has done more for the poor and the wicked than all the preachers and philantropists in the world."

" 'What's the good of being a fine young woman in the prime of life,' she asked, 'if I have to pass all my mornings watching blue-bottles with an Archdukes?' "

Witty and funny :))

Great quotes, kjellika! Her way with words is something that always keeps me reading--even when the "going gets tough." She was a master of wit.

Yes, fabulous quotes. I especially like the sailor comment. :) Was the going getting touch, MusicMom?

I fear I've missed out on the discussion, being so slow, but I'll add my comments anyhow, just to sort my thoughts out.

I liked the gypsy episode, the way they thought all her possessions and titles were a disgrace rather than a privilege, and how her dreamy, introspective nature is seen as a danger. Very funny at the end of chap. 3, when Woolf casually mentions that the young men had already plotted her death.

Orlando's personality has really come out now, and when she reflects that even though she is a woman instead of a man, her personality remained intact, I heartily agreed. Back in London, we see her falling into a repetition of her previous life: a messy encounter with love (the hilarious Archduke), fleeing to the city, searching for a lover, when that fails, falling in with wits and writers, then having them let her down, as well, and running off in disguise to mingle with the commoners.

Woolf certainly has some prejudices against lower class persons, huh? She doesn't always portray them negatively, but Orlando is constantly using them for his/her own ends. On the other hand, she is very critical of the upper classes.

What did everyone make of Rosita (or was it Pepita) the dancer? Strange. I still haven't decided what I think about that.

Oh, and earlier I made a comment about Sasha being an incarnation of lust, compared to Orlando's true love for her. Yet when Orlando becomes a woman, she claims that she suddenly understands Sasha, and is more in love with her than ever. Hmm. Makes one reread the earlier love affair. Perhaps Orlando's "true love" was a man's love, and so he never fully understood Sasha at all. Was she using herself against men because it was the only way she could experience power and love? Just like Orlando feels she must throw herself overboard to get a man's attention, if that is the only avenue available to her. Made me rethink my previous ideas about Sasha, just as Orlando herself did. Very clever, Virginia.

nmhale

I agree--it was in this section I really got "hooked." Loved the gypsy part, also. The change of moods also resonated with me--how she was so much in love with the country life until she went back to the city. I sometimes have that tug of two desires for the kind of life I think I want!

Toward the end of this section and then the last 2 chapters, I enjoyed reading but I felt sometimes as if I were "in a fog"--not always sure I understood what was meant. Woolf often challenges me because I have trouble with ambiguity--and that may be part of what attracts me to her! Getting out of my comfort zone, that is.

Yes, I understand the 'fog' feeling. Since this is a reread, everything has been going much quicker for me. But when I first read it, I put it aside for a while before coming back to finish it. There are a lot of long lyrical passages that aren't really plot related. Like you, her mastery of language pulled me back for more.